Obama has never won a big election

Think about this as the polls show this race is not what most of us thought it would be, especially with Hillary totally on-board.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/109219/Gallup -Daily-Race-Tied-44.aspx

Full disclosure:  

http://craigfarmer.blogspot.com/2008/07/ 2008-election-swing-state-odds.html

I would bet my money on:

Obama  54
McCain 41
others  5

electoral college:
Obama 306  McCain 232

but....
a contrary point:

Obama has never won a big election and maybe he's like the New England Patriots poised to lose for the first time in the biggest possible way.  

As you'll see below, if Obama had won in California, Penn., Tex and Ohio, had an upset in West Virginia or Kentucky, then this would be a moot point.

Think about it:

*state level elections don't count (sorry)
*Senate Race--unbelievable fortune where all viable candidates withdrew or were hit by scandal.
*Presidential Primary:

1. Iowa was a caucus where people got to vote in public.  
In a multi-candiate field:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primari es/results/state/#val=IA
62% percent chose someone other than Obama
38% chose Obama

Included in that 38% were "second choicers" many of whom truly believed (rightly I think) that if Hillary won Iowa it would have been over.

So Obama "won" by getting his base vote + electoral dynamics where everyone's goal was to keep the race going, Anybody But Clinton.

2. New Hampshire --- lost by 2 points -- 1st chance to knock out Clinton

3. South Carolina --Obama wins big BUT about half the voters being black- went 4 - 1 for Obama, while Obama, Edwards and Clinton split white vote.
Again, another big advantage for obama. He was talking about everyone coming together, and moving beyond race as white voters did by splitting their votes, yet black voters chose the black guy.  So I discount this one.

3. Super Tuesday  ---lost every contested state especially California, Mass., and NJ except Missouri (won by 1 point -with big city vote) ---2nd chance to knock out Clinton

Racked up lead in delegates by OUT WORKING CLINTON IN CAUCUS STATES  and having a BETTER CAMPAIGN TEAM-- for example got many more votes by competing in NY than Clinton who left Illinois alone

4. Ohio and Texas  -- lost both 3rd chance to knock out Clinton

5. Pennsylvania - lost  4th chance to knock out Clinton

6.  N.C. and Indiana -- won N.C. similar to S.C. by winning Black democrats 92% --overall 56 - 42 obma
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primari es/results/epolls/#NCDE

Whereas clinton barely won Indiana.  People forgot to note that Indiana borders Illinois and actual shares Chicago t.v. stations.

Close loss in Indiana was considered a win for Obama, because of delegate math(?) and momemtum(?) and no way supers take this away from him now (?)

7.  Won/Lost every state projected to  afterwards many by big margins with the possible exception of Clinton winning South Dakota.

Obama is our nominee because:
1. Clinton picked Solis and Penn to run her campaign and they did a horrible job; while Obama picked a superior team.  This is 20/20 hindsight, but no one seriously questions that if you switch the campaign staffs, you would switch the winner.

2. Caucus states where public voting, organizing, and limited time to participate benefitted the Obama team

3. Democratic sensibilities would not allow Clinton to attack Obama in a "normal" way without it having "racial" overtones and it being inappropriate.  For instance when Howard Dean was attacked as risky and unqualified and unstable there wasn't anyone defending him except on the merits.

4. The Democratic party finally paid a debt to Black voters who regularly support dems with 90%+ support.  This led to certain states like Md, Va., NC, SC, etc. being out of play, and also created an inevitablility for Obama because no one wanted to be the one who stopped him for obvious reasons.

All of this is to say, Obama has never had a straight up election, rolled up his sleeves, had a a fair fight and won.

Now, I don't expect this GE to be a fair fight.

I expect the media to continue to help our side out.

I expect there to be a massive black vote and liberal vote that will be unshakable.  This allows obama to be as moderate/conservative as he wants and not risk a 3rd party defection.

but...

we shouldn't ignore the possibility that this could end in disaster.  At some point the Rev. Wright's, the Ludacris', the Father Phleger, etc. could add up.

People might begin resenting the implied, "i knew america was still racist" implications if obama loses, and call the bluff.

I don't believe this, but then again, i thought obama would be out to a large lead right now.

Craig Farmer



Display:


Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 2)

Something else to think about...
How many of your Diaries receive ANY rec's?
"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:06:40 PM EST

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (1.50 / 2)

I'm trying to change the dem party, so I wouldn't expect to embraced at this point.


by yellowdem1129 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:16:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 2)

Don't worry. In years to come, archivists will return to the google cache and retrieve all your diaries and be able to say "there, there is where the party changed direction. There is the prescient wisdom of the ages, someone who saw all so clearly what was to be done."

Rest assured, yellowdem. Your genius will be recognized. In the meantime, keep posting, if just for the lulz.


"This victory alone is not the change we seek -- it is only the chance for us to make that change." -- Nov. 4, 2008
by BobzCat on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:20:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 3)

No normal person wants 2 "married men living next to them".

Change the Democratic party?  You have the mindset of a person stuck in the 1940's and you have the balls to talk about changing our party for the better?  GFY.


And so, may evil beware and may good dress warmly and eat lots of fresh vegetables.
by thatpurplestuff on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:32:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (1.33 / 3)

I'm going to try something new....

Instead of calling out these pathetic trolls, I am going to call out the enabler.

Hey Jerome you sad loser, pull your head out of your ass and stop trying to prove how wrong everyone is about you and your bullshit concerns.

Only a selfish egomaniac would let their site turn into Hannity's America to prove a point.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:01:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 2)

Maybe he should start fixing the site by banning a psycho stalker like you.


Hillary supporter for Barack Obama in 2008
by zcflint05 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:52:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (1.00 / 2)

Fix the site?

The only way to do that is ban the losers that repeat right wing smears after they have been debunked.

Say it once no problem, say it twice...ciao.

Jerome is too full of himself to ever do that, and the other front pagers are just hoping the quality of their stuff lets them rise above the stench jerome wallows in.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 08:34:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 2)

I like your new approach.  This is a sure fire way of getting yourself banned.  

Keep up the good work!


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 08:21:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Who the fuck cares (1.00 / 1)

Jerome? Ha!

Me? Double Ha!

When I see douches like linfar post crap about being molested so she can continue her smear jobs, I'll  just sign up again to call her the lying little stepford shill she really is.

Then the Stockholm syndrome users here will troll rate me for disrupting their daily passive resistance work shop, and I'll be banned again.

Whoopie shit.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 08:28:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Who the fuck cares (2.00 / 2)

Please get out more.  You're taking this internet thing too seriously.

You need to step back for a bit.


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 11:59:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Who the fuck cares (2.00 / 2)

THE INTERNETS ARE SERIOUS BUSINESS.


by Cincinnatus on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 01:20:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Who the fuck cares (none / 0)

Dammit Cincinnatus!  Now that song is back in my head.

It's strangely haunting...


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 02:05:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 1)

I'm trying to change the dem party, so I wouldn't expect to embraced at this point.

Dear diary: why does no one understand me?  PS: You call me mad?  I am not mad.


I'm voting for Saxby Chambliss!
by Jess81 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:34:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (2.00 / 1)

I'm trying to change the dem party,

Yes. A place where Strom Thurmond, Dick Shelby and Joe Lieberman would feel right at home again?

Thanks, no.


by BlueinColorado on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:15:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (none / 0)

"Our side?"  I do not think it means what you think it means.


by niksder on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:25:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: is that an insult or a compliment? (none / 0)

Well we are all pulling for you to change the dem party... you are surely the person amongst us in the best position to do so.


ENOUGH!
by JDF on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 01:17:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Weak Sauce (2.00 / 2)


Man if your gonna come, come correct!

I just wish you had more faith in your fellow citizens.

Cynicism never built a single country (correct me if I am wrong)


by DemsLandslide2008 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:08:35 PM EST

Re: I show you my blog (none / 0)

I predict Obama to win big.

But what am i supposed to think as it is teetering right now.

Just keep "hoping"?

Well I will but not blindly.

I expect a big bounce out of the convention.

Don't you and everyone else?

So if it doesn't happen that we are up solid 5 or six points after both conventions, something's wrong?  Once the Republican bounce fades, obama should be in the lead for good.


by yellowdem1129 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:19:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I show you my blog (none / 0)

Ok, then look at it this way.

If you believe in Obama, and the progressive message in general, then you know our message ESPECIALLY in these times is extremely logical.

In that framing it is also logical that the more people vote, especially those who haven't voted before will raise OBama's votes exponentially?

Seriously, who can point to me a scenario where a first time voter, who abstained before, is  NOW going to get involved just to vote for McCain.

Seems unlikely to me.

What I want to see from Obama (putting on concern mask) is a Deliberate and strong effort at voter registration.

I would love in the runup to the vote in November him and the DNC saying "Through our efforts we got 3 million people registered, regardless of political party affiliation or lack thereof"

I mean, if you want to get into the nuance.  If GOP loses any more Hispanics its over for McCain.
If AA registration goes up in a few states, another landslide scenario for Obama.


by DemsLandslide2008 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:50:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

It's too late (none / 0)

He won so he's our candidate.

Neither candidate is connecting with the citizens and that's because the media coverage is focused on the horse race and the daily spin and a lot of trivia, not what is really happening to our pocketbooks and our lives.


by spoot on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:24:20 PM EST

Re: It's too late (none / 0)

For my money, the Democratic Presidential Primary is a pretty big election.


by Jay R on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:27:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's too late (1.00 / 2)

Bigger than anything Hillary ever won.

That list minus the primary win is Hillarys political campaign record.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:04:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's too late (2.00 / 2)

I, as a BIG Obama supporter, just troll rated your ass!

Take my advice from above, and get out more.


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 12:02:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

until now


The American people; they were for the war before they were against it.
by nrafter530 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:29:33 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

yellowdem...

just wondering...as you appear to be committed...
Are you committing ANY time..or ANY energy
(you know...ground game shit?)to ANY Dem candidate?)

along with Obama I am knocking on doors for

http://www.repmorgancarroll.com/

Without snark...
if you cannot sacrifice a little personal time..
..if you cannot phone when it might be uncomfortable for you...or knock on doors, when it might be uncomfortable to you?

STFU...and stand aside..so that those of us who are really serious can get to work without YOU in the way...


"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:39:20 PM EST

A big lead? (2.00 / 1)

Every state-based polling report -- nate silver's blog, RCP's polling averages -- you name -- shows Obama up big in the race that matters... you know, that electoral college thing?

I couldn't care less about the national poll numbers.   The fact is - we're probably going to see  a national election popular vote not unlike every national election in our liftimes... a few points one way or another.

The national polls are WORTHLESS.

He's winning the EC -- winning it handily.

All the rest is idle chatter and navel gazing.


by zonk on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:39:21 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

It's true.  It's why I supported HRC.  It's interesting to me that Clinton has a long track record of being instrumental in the career of her husband, didn't have the "audacity" to run for President immediately in 04 (perhaps a mistake in hindsight), won re-election to the Senate in 2006, etc. etc. and could possibly be considered to have had inferior judgment to Barack Obama.

The thing that the Obama campaign seems to have done best is to have gotten inside the mind of Democratic Party base members; they understand how the base works and can affect a media narrative which fits seamlessly into both their preconceived notions and their imaginations.  It's a remarkable ability, to be sure, but at the end of the primary fewer Americans pulled the lever for Barack Obama than did for Hillary Clinton.  As we head into the conventions and into the topsy-turvy universe of American autumnal electoral traditions, there is a part of me that feels as though the party is staring down the long barrel of a gun.  Obama was foisted upon the party by a plurality, included among them many powerful Superdelegates, many of whom voted against their constituents and all of whom voted against the popular vote winner.

I could go on forever, to be honest with you, but mostly I'm just keeping my head down and hoping that Hillary will be able to assuage my fears at the convention.


No candidacy is more important than the right to vote.
by hornplayer on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:40:25 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

Stop the madness.

Obama won the popular vote too.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:07:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

Read what I wrote.  More Americans pulled a lever for Clinton than Obama.  This is entirely true.  Including accurate estimates from the caucus states which did not report their voter rolls, and giving Michigan votes for "uncomitted" to who they voted for--uncommitted.

More Americans, nationwide, voted for Clinton than voted for Obama.  It's not madness.  We can argue about what the "popular vote" is all day, because there really is no such thing in the Presidential primary process, and no real rules by which to determine such a thing.  All there is is one simple truth: more Americans voted for Hillary Clinton on an official ballot than voted for Barack Obama in 2008, period.


No candidacy is more important than the right to vote.
by hornplayer on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:27:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

Who cares.

Man, I feel sorry for you, if your being honest that is.

Its a big world, and life is short and your worried about levers.

Also levers were gone in the 80's


by DemsLandslide2008 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:31:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

There are millions of people in America who care.  I am but one of many who believe in the popular will, and take due care to affect and monitor it.  I had no idea that being such a person could illicit piteous contempt in others of differing opinions, but it's not the most surprising thing that's happened to me.

It's a big world and I happen to love living in it, thank you.  I feel sorry for you; your close minded nature may very well close you out to many good people and good ideas in your lifetime.  I suppose I do fixate on politics a bit, but I certainly wouldn't think that being observant could be as crippling as hubris.  Hopefully your flaws will not cause you too much harm.


No candidacy is more important than the right to vote.
by hornplayer on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:54:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No horn player you are wrong (1.00 / 1)

You are spinning bullshit fed to you by a Clinton campaign desperate to stay viable.

Not even Hillary is claiming to have the most anything any more.

You are dizzy. Stop spinning.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 08:51:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

Surely you are kidding. By your metric only some one who has won a presidential race has won a big election.


Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
by jsfox on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:42:08 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

And NotObama has?

Had Bill Clinton won a BIG election before 1992? Or George washington before 1788?

The crap these people come up with belongs in a museum of the absurd.


by Glaurung on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:43:53 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 3)

Quick summary of right wing talking points, for anyone that cares:

The liberal media is in the bag for Obama.
Obama only got nominated because he's black.
Obama has "never had a fair fight and won."
A friendly reminder that Rev. Wright is going to come back to haunt Obama, as well as Phleger and Ludacris.
Democrats will blame Obama's loss on racism.

No attempt to connect gay marriage with the price of tea in China or the grassy knoll in this diary, so I'm impressed on that account.  Otherwise, it's the typical steaming pile from this diarist.


And so, may evil beware and may good dress warmly and eat lots of fresh vegetables.
by thatpurplestuff on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:44:51 PM EST

And BTW (2.00 / 3)

this is complete bunk:

*Senate Race--unbelievable fortune where all viable candidates withdrew or were hit by scandal.

Here's some history on the primary -- you might want to check it out; you'd be better informed next time you write... http://www.ilsenate.com/default.asp

Contrary to popular belief - the favorite in the primary was state Comptroller Dan Hynes.  Hynes' dad is  legendary south side ward boss.  Hynes' campaign co-chairs were John Daley (Mayor Daley's brother) and John Stroger, who's probably had a more powerful machine than Daley.

Hynes led the polling through most of 2003 -- until Hull dumped a buttload of money into the race.

At no time did any "scandal" hit Dan Hynes.  Obama simply beat him... soundly... in his own backyard -- Obama didn't just win a plurality in the primary, he scored 53% in a crowded 6 way primary, with 3 to 4 legitimate big name Dems.

Do your homework next time... your concern trolling might be taken seriously.


by zonk on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:45:43 PM EST

i doubt it... (2.00 / 2)

i'm the first to recognize that hillary clinton ran an incredibly shitty campaign, one that we will study for years on what not to do in campaigns, but:

barack obama beat the inevitable candidate, the first name in democratic politics, The One we were supposedly waiting for to save democrats.  sure, hillary's campaign self-destructed, but no one else beat her.  barack obama did.

the idiots who think that beating the chicago political machine is easy are just too naive to take seriously.  but those who overlook the fact the obama beat the shit out of the clintons, that's beyond stupidity.  we need to call out the straight-jacket squad for them.  yes, hillary was an incredibly incompetent presidential candidate.  but she was the clinton.  she was The One.  obama accepted the challenge, and won.  any sane person has to admire that...


"stand with me, and fight by my side." -- Barack Obama
by bored now on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:57:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: i doubt it... (2.00 / 1)

Absolutely.

It's the falsehoods about the IL Senate race that really, really tick me off -- to a great extent, part of it is because I volunteered in that race (back when Obama was polling a very distant 3rd/4th).

Another little known fact -- even before Jack Ryan was forced out of the race by the GOP, the closest poll had him down 11 pts.   Jack Ryan was never within double digits in that race.  The media certainly wanted to make a race out of it -- but everyone knew the winner of the Democratic primary was going to be our Senator (hence why every Democrat that didn't have designs on another office ran).

Obama won that primary - and the GE - the old fashioned way - he earned it... regardless of Hull's domestic violence scandals.


by zonk on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:26:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 2)

You know, if I had it all to do over again, I would still bet on the Patriots to win.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 06:57:49 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

Listen...
it is not just about yellowdem...

How many folks commenting have yet to be directly involved in the ground effort of a candidate this year?

It is pretty simple. Either you believe some candidate is worth a little sacrifice of your time and ego or you don't?

It is certainly not too late. Real democracy (like any great rock-n-roll)is NOT a passive experience.


"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:00:15 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

It amazes me that Hillary supporters were so invested in her that they cannot move on.  It took me one week when JRE lost to move on.  If you are a real democrat you will be for the democratic candidate regardless of who it is.  I was invested in JRE, and fought for him until the end, but he lost and that was it.  If Obama would have lost and Hillary won, I would have been upset for a week or so, but than I would have supported Hillary because I am a democrat first.  I am a democrat first, and will never be so invested in a person that I lose all perspective.


by Spanky on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:04:18 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (1.00 / 1)

The problem is the lies and spin Hillary used to justify continui9ng and hoping the supers would hand it to her.

Se created a toxic environment that her supporters lapped up.

Now they believe their own lies.

The leaders make shit up and pass it around.

Obama stole the nom by bribing sd.
Obama has dangerous radical friends
Obama lost the states that matter
Obama played the race card
Obama isn't as experienced as hillary and is dangerous because of it.

The list goes on.

Add the internet letting these sad pathetic people congregate to wallow in their misery, add rat fuck republicans looking to create a left flank attack, add more than a few nasty racists, and add some deranged narcissism and you get PUMA.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:17:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 2)

Here's a hint: you're helping stop the primary wars about as much as the PUMAs are, moron.

You're just as bad as they are...


Hillary supporter for Barack Obama in 2008
by zcflint05 on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:57:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (1.33 / 3)

No, not even close.

I don't lie about Hillary.
I don't conspire with republicans.
I don't go on fox news to bash howard dean.

Just because you can take getting spit on every day doesn't make you the arbiter of Unity(tm).

I'm not a condescending dip shit that's going to say to the likes of linfar...

"Ah, there there, you are special, you are important, and everyone loves you"...

in some attempt to appease the lunatics, republicans, and racists that support the lies she spoon feeds them.

That linfar got a taste of her own medicine from the PUMA crew for daring to dip a toe in the Obama water shouldn't surprise her.

She helped create the rabid atmosphere.

She wants sympathy from Obama supporters because they turned on her? She wants to use their venom as a form of Obama street cred now?

Fuck her. And her non apology.

And fuck those that participate on websites that promote xenophobic, racist hate.

Fuck catfish and her race baiting article on reparations at Alegre's website.

You need to open your fucking eyes to what these dirt bags on this site are saying and doing on other sites as well as this one.


by linfarted on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 08:49:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

I just Rec'd
Bullshit can be saved and worth of study...
"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:07:56 PM EST

why doesn't winning primary count? (none / 0)

Do you consider beating HRC a big election?


Rrrinnggg... Time to change the government.
by Carl Nyberg on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:13:09 PM EST

Re: Beating Hillary (none / 0)

didn't count as a "BIG" Victory according to the Diarist....

WTF?

 'nuff sed. The whole premise is flawed.


"But not me personally were those cheers for"
by QTG on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:16:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (2.00 / 1)

so far it isn't looking good, no need to shoot the messenger, there is still time to change the discourse to issues and away from personalities.

Barack must be the representative for change, not the example.  He may work as the example for younger voters, but the electorate wants to know what the president will do, and cares less about the personality. Both John and Barack are high personality candidates, and in a toss up between personalities I'd bet on Barack.

But on issues Barack can beat McCain hands down, if he runs as an issues guy and stops the personality stuff.  He needs to speak much more specifically about what's wrong and what needs to be changed, and how to do it, what the steps are.  In some way he's positioned for this now, everyone would listen he has the ear of the nation.  He has the experts now, and the professionals, he has the help of Hillary and her huge entourage, Madeline Albright is now one of his advisors.

Sometimes when a strategy isn't working you have to change the strategy, not yell at those who point out that it isn't working?  


what a relief
by anna shane on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 07:39:45 PM EST

Issues? (none / 0)

Watch the McCain campaign closely. Please.

Obama is already crushing them on the issues. He's ahead 28% on energy, for example. If this were an issue based campaign, it would be a landslide.

This is why McCain does not want it to be about issues. Issues are currently irrelevant, Paris Hilton ads are the meat of the day. Obama can talk issues all he likes, he will still be too skinny/unpatriotic/messianic. "Issues" don't get the air time on Morning Joe.

Madeline won't change a thing, unless she does something "interesting" like call McCain a rat bastard. THAT might get some traction.


by Neef on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 10:25:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Issues? (none / 0)

you're wrong, he can change this debate away from attacks and onto issues.  I don't know if that's his plan to win, but it's a choice.  


what a relief
by anna shane on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 01:37:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I respectfully disagree (none / 0)

McCain has the initiative at the moment. Until he runs out of clever ads (which WILL happen at some point), grade-school politics consumes the news cycles.

If you listen closely, Obama IS sticking to issues, which is why half the blogosphere is pissed off at him. They want him to get negative in response, but he's staying on message (or trying to).

In the short term no candidate can beat a Messiah Ad by restating his energy policy. In the long term, let's hope the issues resurface.


by Neef on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 02:08:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

What about his election to the US Senate from the great state of Illinois. Hillary got lucky. First Rudy G got prostate cancer and then the Republicans picked an idiot to replace him. Obama had to work his way through a tough Democratic field, although Alan Keyes was admittedly an unlikely and unlikeable candidate for the Republicans.

I only recently returned to MYdd. I was so turned off by the Hillary insanity here. I can't believe that most of the diarists here still seem to suffer from profound anal-cranial inversion. Let me know when you guys come back to reality.


by OIL GUY on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 09:03:03 PM EST

So, to recap your post (2.00 / 1)

Obama never won a big election.

Except for one that I don't count,

And one that I think was easy,

And one that I think was close.

Solid, objective analysis there. Now lets analyze how Kerry never lost a Presidential election.


by Neef on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 10:30:36 PM EST

this diary is nonsense. (none / 0)

and you sir make me sick with your continual gay bashing.

please go away.


"Democracy! Bah! When I hear that I reach for my feather Boa!" Allen Ginsberg
by canadian gal on Fri Aug 01, 2008 at 11:57:55 PM EST

Re: this diary is nonsense. (1.50 / 2)

I wish he would get banned already. His homophobic rants are the biggest black eye on this site.


Welcome to a landslide WITH white working class, latinos, women and holding on sweeties!!!
by spacemanspiff on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 01:51:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Stupidest Title Ever (none / 0)

You win!


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Sat Aug 02, 2008 at 05:44:51 PM EST

Re: Obama has never won a big election (none / 0)

Hate to burst your bubble, but Hillary never won a big election either.   Bill did.  She blew out her opponents in the Senate races, just as Obama did.

Now had GUiliani not dropped due to his cancer, it would have been an epic race.

And Obama has won a big election... the primary race.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Sun Aug 03, 2008 at 01:12:46 AM EST


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